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	<title>Comments on: Blueprint Breakdown: The Water Room</title>
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	<link>http://urbangardenmagazine.com/2009/12/hydroponics-blueprint-breakdown-the-water-garden/</link>
	<description>Hydroponics for Growing Minds</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Thu, 29 Jul 2010 22:49:09 -0700</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Lucas/Hydro Innovations</title>
		<link>http://urbangardenmagazine.com/2009/12/hydroponics-blueprint-breakdown-the-water-garden/comment-page-1/#comment-1128</link>
		<dc:creator>Lucas/Hydro Innovations</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Jun 2010 17:47:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://urbangardenmagazine.com/?p=2227#comment-1128</guid>
		<description>WW,

That is a very good question.  Most of the time it is too warm in the garden area while the lights are on to allow the fans to slow down too much to be an issue.   But always be sure that the temperature sensor is placed in such a way to give you an accurate reading in order to control fan speed accordingly.  Stephen recommends pushing the sensor through a small square of styrofoam(2&quot; X 2&quot;) so that the sensor sits just below the styrofoam out of direct light.  Let us know if you have anymore questions by sending them to support@hydroinnovations.com .  

Thanks,
Lucas</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>WW,</p>
<p>That is a very good question.  Most of the time it is too warm in the garden area while the lights are on to allow the fans to slow down too much to be an issue.   But always be sure that the temperature sensor is placed in such a way to give you an accurate reading in order to control fan speed accordingly.  Stephen recommends pushing the sensor through a small square of styrofoam(2&#8243; X 2&#8243;) so that the sensor sits just below the styrofoam out of direct light.  Let us know if you have anymore questions by sending them to <a href="mailto:support@hydroinnovations.com">support@hydroinnovations.com</a> .  </p>
<p>Thanks,<br />
Lucas</p>
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		<title>By: WhippinWater</title>
		<link>http://urbangardenmagazine.com/2009/12/hydroponics-blueprint-breakdown-the-water-garden/comment-page-1/#comment-1126</link>
		<dc:creator>WhippinWater</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Jun 2010 15:01:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://urbangardenmagazine.com/?p=2227#comment-1126</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m trying to better understand the use of thermostats on the ice boxes, does the increasing and decreasing fan speed cause the light area under the reflector to get hotter?  When the fan decreases will the light then be too close or should I use the lowest fan speed to determine the distance from the plants?  Could you clarify this for us Stephen?  Thanks!

WW</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m trying to better understand the use of thermostats on the ice boxes, does the increasing and decreasing fan speed cause the light area under the reflector to get hotter?  When the fan decreases will the light then be too close or should I use the lowest fan speed to determine the distance from the plants?  Could you clarify this for us Stephen?  Thanks!</p>
<p>WW</p>
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		<title>By: Andrew</title>
		<link>http://urbangardenmagazine.com/2009/12/hydroponics-blueprint-breakdown-the-water-garden/comment-page-1/#comment-1104</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 Jun 2010 23:51:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://urbangardenmagazine.com/?p=2227#comment-1104</guid>
		<description>I have 2-cool tubes (2-1000&#039;s at each end) with a diameter of 6&quot;. I just bought a water cooled CO2 from H.I.. Know ,if I want to run 4000 watts ,in a 8 foot by 8 foot room ?, or a 12 foot by 6 foot room?, what should I purchase ? ,how many ICE Boxes ?. I also am buying an Ice Cap. I only have a 1/4 hp Active Aqua water chiller . I have 2-6&quot; inline fans (605 &amp; 450 cfm) &amp; an 8&quot;650 cfm . I have a small air conditioner, is it needed?, &amp; how whould I set this room up ?. Please any advice is well appreciated !!!!! Thanks in advance !!!!! Andrew</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have 2-cool tubes (2-1000&#8217;s at each end) with a diameter of 6&#8243;. I just bought a water cooled CO2 from H.I.. Know ,if I want to run 4000 watts ,in a 8 foot by 8 foot room ?, or a 12 foot by 6 foot room?, what should I purchase ? ,how many ICE Boxes ?. I also am buying an Ice Cap. I only have a 1/4 hp Active Aqua water chiller . I have 2-6&#8243; inline fans (605 &amp; 450 cfm) &amp; an 8&#8243;650 cfm . I have a small air conditioner, is it needed?, &amp; how whould I set this room up ?. Please any advice is well appreciated !!!!! Thanks in advance !!!!! Andrew</p>
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		<title>By: Hydroguy</title>
		<link>http://urbangardenmagazine.com/2009/12/hydroponics-blueprint-breakdown-the-water-garden/comment-page-1/#comment-1092</link>
		<dc:creator>Hydroguy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Jun 2010 00:36:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://urbangardenmagazine.com/?p=2227#comment-1092</guid>
		<description>Very interesting article and system design. I look forward to seeing a real-world demonstration when possible.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Very interesting article and system design. I look forward to seeing a real-world demonstration when possible.</p>
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		<title>By: stephen</title>
		<link>http://urbangardenmagazine.com/2009/12/hydroponics-blueprint-breakdown-the-water-garden/comment-page-1/#comment-1090</link>
		<dc:creator>stephen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Jun 2010 01:41:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://urbangardenmagazine.com/?p=2227#comment-1090</guid>
		<description>Hi Taylor,

Just a few tips to help you get the most out of your system. The Ice Box should always be after the light and will not cool as efficiently if placed in front. Typically we have found also that the fans do better pulling air through the reflector than pushing (as I think you also found--you tend to get better air flow this way). The air temperature exiting the Ice Box is determined primarily by the water temperature, but flow rate for both air and water will also play a role.

Condensation can be eliminated if you&#039;re experiencing it. Condensation will happen any time the water being used for cooling is lower than the dewpoint temperature (dewpoint temperature is a combination of relative humidity and ambient temperature, there are free calculators online).  This could be from running the water at a colder temperature than it needs to be, high humidity in your garden, or a combination of both. We recommend using our system at or below 55% humidity which will stop any condensation problems from occurring. If you have higher humidity than that adjustments have to be made by either running a dehumidifier (as you mention).  If humidity can&#039;t be controlled, you can raise your water temperature to above the dew point temperature. If doing so results in warmer than desired garden temperatures, you can increase the efficiency of the system by adding another Ice Box on a fan wall-mounted for example. Doing this will result in better performance at a higher water temperature.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Taylor,</p>
<p>Just a few tips to help you get the most out of your system. The Ice Box should always be after the light and will not cool as efficiently if placed in front. Typically we have found also that the fans do better pulling air through the reflector than pushing (as I think you also found&#8211;you tend to get better air flow this way). The air temperature exiting the Ice Box is determined primarily by the water temperature, but flow rate for both air and water will also play a role.</p>
<p>Condensation can be eliminated if you&#8217;re experiencing it. Condensation will happen any time the water being used for cooling is lower than the dewpoint temperature (dewpoint temperature is a combination of relative humidity and ambient temperature, there are free calculators online).  This could be from running the water at a colder temperature than it needs to be, high humidity in your garden, or a combination of both. We recommend using our system at or below 55% humidity which will stop any condensation problems from occurring. If you have higher humidity than that adjustments have to be made by either running a dehumidifier (as you mention).  If humidity can&#8217;t be controlled, you can raise your water temperature to above the dew point temperature. If doing so results in warmer than desired garden temperatures, you can increase the efficiency of the system by adding another Ice Box on a fan wall-mounted for example. Doing this will result in better performance at a higher water temperature.</p>
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		<title>By: Taylor Wayne</title>
		<link>http://urbangardenmagazine.com/2009/12/hydroponics-blueprint-breakdown-the-water-garden/comment-page-1/#comment-1088</link>
		<dc:creator>Taylor Wayne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 Jun 2010 19:25:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://urbangardenmagazine.com/?p=2227#comment-1088</guid>
		<description>A friend gave me his Ice Box after he closed his garden and I have been playing with it of 10 days now.  I have a 500 cfm fan connected to one 600 watt light. We have 1200 watts total but only one light has an enclosed reflector at this time. At first I set it up to push the air through my reflector and this worked well.  

Next, I set it up to pull the air through the reflector.  This set up worked even better.  Exiting air temps run to 75 degrees when pushing the air but I was able to cool the exiting air to 67 degrees by pulling the air.   However, after about 1 hour condensation became a huge problem.  So, I set it up again to push the air.

I assume the reason I encountered so much condensation was because the air being pushed was about the same temp as the being pulled.  

The system was working too well, if you will.  I also assume that by adding other controls, ie: fan control and/or a dehumidifier.  That I will be able to control temps so that condensation will be less of a problem or nearly eliminated.

I&#039;m sold on water cooling.  This is my third summer and I&#039;ll have fewer headaches because of heat.  Nothing worse than walking in to your grow space and seeing temps in the 90s.  

Wish I&#039;d discovered this cool idea sooner.

Now, I&#039;m saving for a chiller.

Good Day!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A friend gave me his Ice Box after he closed his garden and I have been playing with it of 10 days now.  I have a 500 cfm fan connected to one 600 watt light. We have 1200 watts total but only one light has an enclosed reflector at this time. At first I set it up to push the air through my reflector and this worked well.  </p>
<p>Next, I set it up to pull the air through the reflector.  This set up worked even better.  Exiting air temps run to 75 degrees when pushing the air but I was able to cool the exiting air to 67 degrees by pulling the air.   However, after about 1 hour condensation became a huge problem.  So, I set it up again to push the air.</p>
<p>I assume the reason I encountered so much condensation was because the air being pushed was about the same temp as the being pulled.  </p>
<p>The system was working too well, if you will.  I also assume that by adding other controls, ie: fan control and/or a dehumidifier.  That I will be able to control temps so that condensation will be less of a problem or nearly eliminated.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m sold on water cooling.  This is my third summer and I&#8217;ll have fewer headaches because of heat.  Nothing worse than walking in to your grow space and seeing temps in the 90s.  </p>
<p>Wish I&#8217;d discovered this cool idea sooner.</p>
<p>Now, I&#8217;m saving for a chiller.</p>
<p>Good Day!</p>
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		<title>By: Curtis</title>
		<link>http://urbangardenmagazine.com/2009/12/hydroponics-blueprint-breakdown-the-water-garden/comment-page-1/#comment-848</link>
		<dc:creator>Curtis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Mar 2010 20:18:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://urbangardenmagazine.com/?p=2227#comment-848</guid>
		<description>To Jason&#039;s point about adding up expense. . . 

If you need to add a cheap, dehumidifying solution, don&#039;t reinvent the wheel and don&#039;t get a fancy gardening dehumidifier.

Get a dehumidifier from $25 (333 cubic feet) to $40 (for the 500 cubic ft version) from EvaDry.

http://evadry.reachlocal.net/products.html

Small, simple, and should work for 10 yrs or so.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To Jason&#8217;s point about adding up expense. . . </p>
<p>If you need to add a cheap, dehumidifying solution, don&#8217;t reinvent the wheel and don&#8217;t get a fancy gardening dehumidifier.</p>
<p>Get a dehumidifier from $25 (333 cubic feet) to $40 (for the 500 cubic ft version) from EvaDry.</p>
<p><a href="http://evadry.reachlocal.net/products.html" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">http://evadry.reachlocal.net/products.html</a></p>
<p>Small, simple, and should work for 10 yrs or so.</p>
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		<title>By: stephen</title>
		<link>http://urbangardenmagazine.com/2009/12/hydroponics-blueprint-breakdown-the-water-garden/comment-page-1/#comment-310</link>
		<dc:creator>stephen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Feb 2010 23:10:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://urbangardenmagazine.com/?p=2227#comment-310</guid>
		<description>We posted some new videos about about water-cooling, for more information go to...

http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=hydro+innovations&amp;search_type=&amp;aq=0&amp;oq=hydro+in</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We posted some new videos about about water-cooling, for more information go to&#8230;</p>
<p><a href="http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=hydro+innovations&amp;search_type=&amp;aq=0&amp;oq=hydro+in" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=hydro+innovations&amp;search_type=&amp;aq=0&amp;oq=hydro+in</a></p>
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		<title>By: stephen</title>
		<link>http://urbangardenmagazine.com/2009/12/hydroponics-blueprint-breakdown-the-water-garden/comment-page-1/#comment-309</link>
		<dc:creator>stephen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Feb 2010 22:49:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://urbangardenmagazine.com/?p=2227#comment-309</guid>
		<description>Jason,

We appreciate your feedback and honestly I hope the advice that we posted here for you will help anyone else who may be having a similar issue.

High humidity is the nemesis of the water-cooled setup and is basically the only problem that you will run into in certain gardens. I think that you could have added an extra Ice Box ($150) to the fan that you already had OR added a small dehumidifier ($150) and it would have worked fine. There are certain steps that may need to be made if there is high humidity in the growing environment. For only a little bit more investment, though, you could have had complete control over your garden and would have overcome the condensation problem you were having. For me it seems like a small price to pay to have optimal conditions (considering the increase in yields). Sounds like the condensation was more of an annoyance than a problem since the remedy was simple and wasn&#039;t worth it to you.

As far as the plastic thickness...it&#039;s all about weight. We could have designed the plastic to be twice as thick and it would have only cost pennies extra but we wanted the lightest product possible since it was mounting to reflectors. The Ice Box ABS plastic has UV inhibitors and is very strong. We haven&#039;t had a single returned unit (out of sales over 3k) for any reason so honestly we feel like the design is perfect!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jason,</p>
<p>We appreciate your feedback and honestly I hope the advice that we posted here for you will help anyone else who may be having a similar issue.</p>
<p>High humidity is the nemesis of the water-cooled setup and is basically the only problem that you will run into in certain gardens. I think that you could have added an extra Ice Box ($150) to the fan that you already had OR added a small dehumidifier ($150) and it would have worked fine. There are certain steps that may need to be made if there is high humidity in the growing environment. For only a little bit more investment, though, you could have had complete control over your garden and would have overcome the condensation problem you were having. For me it seems like a small price to pay to have optimal conditions (considering the increase in yields). Sounds like the condensation was more of an annoyance than a problem since the remedy was simple and wasn&#8217;t worth it to you.</p>
<p>As far as the plastic thickness&#8230;it&#8217;s all about weight. We could have designed the plastic to be twice as thick and it would have only cost pennies extra but we wanted the lightest product possible since it was mounting to reflectors. The Ice Box ABS plastic has UV inhibitors and is very strong. We haven&#8217;t had a single returned unit (out of sales over 3k) for any reason so honestly we feel like the design is perfect!</p>
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		<title>By: jason</title>
		<link>http://urbangardenmagazine.com/2009/12/hydroponics-blueprint-breakdown-the-water-garden/comment-page-1/#comment-207</link>
		<dc:creator>jason</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Feb 2010 23:34:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://urbangardenmagazine.com/?p=2227#comment-207</guid>
		<description>Stephen, not to dis your products, which I think are pretty well-designed (although the plastic on the Icebox units is a bit thin)... However I ran a 1kw lamp inside a Magnum 6&quot; reflector with one Icebox on one end and a 6&quot; inline fan on the other end, running to a 55gal barrel outside the room.  The water in the barrel was cooled with a Chill King 1/2 hp chiller, kept at 60 F.  This was last August when ambient temps were 80F+ outside the room.  I experienced a lot of condensation on the water lines, which dripped down into my garden.  I was told by Ryan (good guy) that I needed to add ANOTHER fan and Icebox, plus a dehumidifier to keep the room around 50% (it wasn&#039;t much more than that).  I kinda gave up at that point,  so in all fairness I suppose it might&#039;ve worked if I&#039;d added those components.  But, I wanted to keep it cheap and simple, and it was just getting more and more expensive.  However my client seems OK with his four light setup.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Stephen, not to dis your products, which I think are pretty well-designed (although the plastic on the Icebox units is a bit thin)&#8230; However I ran a 1kw lamp inside a Magnum 6&#8243; reflector with one Icebox on one end and a 6&#8243; inline fan on the other end, running to a 55gal barrel outside the room.  The water in the barrel was cooled with a Chill King 1/2 hp chiller, kept at 60 F.  This was last August when ambient temps were 80F+ outside the room.  I experienced a lot of condensation on the water lines, which dripped down into my garden.  I was told by Ryan (good guy) that I needed to add ANOTHER fan and Icebox, plus a dehumidifier to keep the room around 50% (it wasn&#8217;t much more than that).  I kinda gave up at that point,  so in all fairness I suppose it might&#8217;ve worked if I&#8217;d added those components.  But, I wanted to keep it cheap and simple, and it was just getting more and more expensive.  However my client seems OK with his four light setup.</p>
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